Press Conference Williamtown, New South Wales

SUBJECTS: Albanese Government to Deliver Meaningful Reform for PFAS-Affected Communities; Wind Farms; Peter Dutton’s Nuclear Gamble.

MERYL SWANSON, MEMBER FOR PATERSON: Good morning everyone, and thank you sincerely for being here at Murrook, the home of the Worimi people, and I just want to firstly say a great big thank you to Andrew Smith and the Worimi Elders for hosting us here this morning at Murrook. It is such a beautiful cultural centre, and we are here on magnificent land of the Worimi, who have walked hand in hand with our community, not only for the last nearly nine years of this PFAS saga, but continue to walk with us all the time. So thank you Andrew. You are an amazing person, and you are leading a group of leaders like no other here at Murrook. I'm hoping that today will be a day where we turn a page for a new chapter in a long saga. PFAS is the reason that I got into politics, to be honest with you. I was working at 2NURFM on the radio, and I got that Newcastle Herald on the 4th of September 2015, with a skull and crossbone on the front that said that our land had been contaminated. And I just want to say a very big thank you to my community who have been on a journey like no other. No one can ever understand unless you've been on that journey. But it does give me an enormous amount of pride to thank my community, and also welcome Minister Matt Keogh. Minister Matt Keogh is responsible, not only for veterans in Australia, but he is also the Minister for Defence Personnel. And I whole heartedly thank him for his work, and his effort working with our government and the Prime Minister and Cabinet in making today a reality. Minister Matt Keogh.

MINISTER FOR VETERANS’ AFFAIRS AND DEFENCE PERSONNEL, MATT KEOGH: Thanks, Meryl. Today is an important milestone when it comes to PFAS in the community here in Williamtown, but also around the different places across Australia. As people know, PFAS is known as a forever chemical. And it's used in so many different ways around the world. In so many different places in our households, in our community and industry. But in particular, it has been used on Defence bases in a way that has caused contamination to the land, not only on those bases, but in the land around those bases as well. And we've seen that particularly for the community of Williamtown, as well as the communities around Oakey, in Queensland, and Tindal in the Northern Territory. As well as other parts of Australia. As Meryl said, the community here in Williamtown, in particular, has really suffered as a consequence of that contamination. Not just in terms of the impact on land, but the anxiety that it has caused for the community. And Meryl has been a huge champion for the community here. As she has really for the communities around Australia that have been impacted. And it's why we committed from opposition to conducting an independent review of those impacts and engaging with the community. To better understand how we can all move forward together. The reality was that for the community here, their calls, for more assistance, their calls for better information, were falling on deaf ears. Our government has responded to that, and it commissioned an independent report conducted by Jim Varghese, which we received earlier this year. And today we are releasing that report. You can see this is a weighty tome that goes directly to the issues being confronted by communities like those here in Williamtown. We're also releasing the government's response to that report. The Report makes 19 recommendations. We're accepting 18 of those recommendations. We've noted the other recommendation for some further work to still be conducted. The recommendations address some of the core concerns of the community. The review engaged with experts, engaged with academics, engaged with those people that have been working on the science. And it also importantly engaged with the communities, the three key impacted communities, here in Williamtown, in Oakey and Tindal. It heard from them about the impacts on their land, it also heard about the impacts on them as people, as well, and the anxiety that has been caused from a lack of clear, understandable, and actionable information. And that's why in adopting the recommendations in this Report, we are standing up a national coordination body. And that body will work across the relevant agencies at a Commonwealth level, as you would expect, the Department of Defence, Department of Health, Department of the Environment, Transport and Infrastructure, but also working with the relevant agencies at a state level and local government level as well. And this is really important that we take a nationally coordinated approach across all the relevant departments, across all three levels of government, in developing appropriate responses, but also critically sharing the science, which is evolving rapidly at this time, so that the communities know what's going on. They understand the impacts on their health, the impacts on their property, and are able to take appropriate actions. Critical to that work is also going to be working groups being set up right here in Williamtown, as well as looking to set up working groups in the other locations. Meryl will be involved as part of that working group, representing her community. That's really important. And those working groups will look at the real world impacts on the ground, engaging with the property owners, looking at how we can best support them, as well as looking at the issues like we see here in Williamtown around drainage. We know that property owners in the surrounding areas of the Williamtown base are concerned, and that's why we will be appointing an independent assessor to look at what are the ongoing impacts of contamination. What are, how is that contamination moving, and how can it be mitigated as well? What are the things that we can put in place? How are those mitigation technologies improving, and where we need to, what are the supports that are required for those landowners and the community here at Williamtown, and then the other parts of Australia, like Oakey and Tindal as well. So we're adopting the recommendations in this independent review. We will have an independent assessor. We'll have a national coordinating body operating across all three levels of government, and we'll have a local working group responding to the needs of the community and advising the national coordinating body, working with them, and supporting the work that the government needs to do to support these communities going forward. What the review gives us, and what we have agreed to in the Government's Response, is a framework moving forward that will ensure that these communities, like Williamtown, are going to be better informed with clearer, more up-to-date scientific information presented in a way that is easily understood, so that landowners know not just what they can't do, but what they can do with their property, and that we'll continue to work with them and the community more broadly going forward. I think this is a really important milestone in making sure that we are listening to the community, and we're responding to the needs of the community. And I really want to pay tribute to Meryl for the way in which she has been such a champion for the community here, but also as a champion for the communities affected by PFAS more broadly around the country. She has been a champion. She has been one of those people that is constantly in the ear of ministers, a thorn in our side, in a good way. That's what you expect from a good local representative like Meryl. That's exactly what she's been doing. It's why we want to see her as part of the working group going forward as well. And I'll hand over to Meryl to say a bit more about the local impacts here.

SWANSON: Thanks Minister. We really appreciate it. Look, I just want to say a couple of things. The working group will be pivotal, and I'm looking forward to catching up with members of our community today as they come to the information sessions and this evening to talk more about that. We'll be starting to pull that together from the early parts of next year, and that's important that we have timeframes on this as well. I do want to particularly single out just four people at this stage - Lindsay Clout, Justin Hamilton, Steve Coun, and Nigel Morgan, who have worked with me and the Minister to pull together the Report from a within-town perspective. And I also want to thank Jim Varghese and his team. Jim was someone who was just absolutely perfect to be the independent reviewer, in my opinion. He brought a level of expertise, he brought a level of empathy to our community. And I think that when you read the Report, you'll understand what I'm talking about. I feel as though he has really nailed it and picked up the community sentiment. I'm very proud of the Report, and I'm sincerely thankful for that. And more broadly, I just want to thank the people of Williamtown and Oakey and Tindal. We've all been on this horrendous journey together. It has been incredibly difficult, and none of us really know what it feels like unless we wake up in the shoes, in the beds of these people who live here. But as a government, we have taken action, we have listened. I lived through those long years in opposition. Saw a government with a lot of talking, but they didn't do much for my people. I'm proud to be part of a government who's taking action on PFAS for my community. And I couldn’t be more honoured to represent them. And as I said earlier, turn the page, and hopefully today, the start of a new chapter, a positive chapter in the saga, for the people of Williamtown. And more broadly, all the people who are impacted by this hideous chemical. Thanks, everyone, I'll let the Minister take the floor.

JOURNALIST: I guess, do you think we'll ever be able to get to the point where residents can use their bore water again, and grow vegetables and swim comfortably?

MINISTER KEOGH: I think one of the really critical things to understand, I think most people in the community understand, that PFAS is a forever chemical. But what is evolving over time is the technology is available to clean soil, clean water in particular, and to mitigate the impacts of PFAS. And also the understanding of the impacts, and what is really important about what the review goes to, and our response is making sure that communities have that information. So as that technology evolves, making sure that the community has that information, landowners know what they can do, what they can't do, but then as it changes, that that's updated for them as well. So that we're taking the uncertainty and the anxiety out of being a landowner in this area, and working with them to support them.

JOURNALIST: That's right. I believe back in 2018, there were concerns around a cancer cluster of 50 cases along Cabbage Tree Road in 15 years, and that was kind of thrown out by the Government and sort of rubbished. Will that be investigated again at all? Because there are still residents that still obviously held those health concerns very seriously despite what the Government says.

MINISTER KEOGH: So certainly as information evolves, we'll engage with that information and we're seeing, remember, this is not just an issue confronting us in Australia, this is an issue, PFAS is an issue confronting the world. And what that means is as our understanding of PFAS evolves and changes, and our understanding of the health impacts evolve and change, we will be addressing that and dealing with those issues, and the important thing coming out of this is that things aren't being hidden, they're about giving that information to the community in a way that is clear, and in a way that is able to be understood so we can work with the community.

JOURNALIST: In regards to those health concerns, if it is identified that PFAS is causing these kinds of health concerns, how does the government respond?

MINISTER KEOGH: Well I think as the science, as the medical science in particular, evolve, we'll deal with those issues as we confront them and as that evolves. That's not an issue that's on the table right now, but the commitment that comes through, following through, with the Independent Review, is that we're making sure that we collate that information at an international level and making it available to the community so they understand that, and if those issues become pertinent, we’ll deal with them at that time, it's a bit hard to deal with a hypothetical, and that's not the situation we're looking at at the moment.

JOURNALIST: When you also look at potential land uses or Defence, what uses are identified?

MINISTER KEOGH: So the key thing here is that when it comes to planning and land use, it revolves having to deal with all three levels of government, local government, state government, and federal government, and so by having this national coordinating body, and the work that we're developing, each of the local areas, we're able to bring together the opportunity of looking at what are the alternative uses and what are the planning options to make those available so that we're giving the best opportunities to landowners in the circumstances that they're now confronting. They're the things that we'll be working through as part of the work that we've agreed to do, that was recommended by the review.

JOURNALIST: I think a lot of people were hoping that this would look for, I guess, suggested land uses for that land. What would your response be to people?

MINISTER KEOGH: Well, I think what the review's highlighted is there's lots of different potentials, but there's issues that need to be worked through at multiple levels of government. As you can appreciate, this is a review that was commissioned by the federal government, recognising our being interested in making sure that we're supporting the community here. But to do that further work involves engaging with the state government and the local government as well relevant planning authorities, but also as wall as the relevant environmental approval authorities as well. I would like to think we're not taking a closed approach to this. We want to look at all of the different planning options that may be available to support all of the different options for land use, that would maximise the position for the landowners as they are now, in a way that is suitable to the community, but gives the landowners the best options available to them as well. And so, in the sense that the review does not go to specific land uses, that is useful because it's not closing off any option available.

JOURNALIST: Particularly for communities like Williamtown, you know, this has been a long-standing issue, and as you mentioned, an anxiety-inducing problem. I mean, I think they would appreciate the working groups and that actually moving forward, but are there specific timeframes set aside in the review for, you know, when we can expect changes to be made?

MINISTER KEOGH: So the review doesn't set out timeframes for these actions, but what it does do is it calls for a number of things to be happening during. So setting up the coordinating body, setting up the working group, appointing an independent assessor to look at the properties that have been affected, and to examine what opportunities may be available for them to provide that advice. The review is very clear that it wants government to move on these things quickly. And we are going to move on these things quickly. It's why we're out here today releasing the review and the government response, because we want to make sure that we're being transparent with the community, giving them that information and being able to move forward as quickly as we are able to.

JOURNALIST: What are some of those actions that are underway right now? Or you can tell us will be starting within weeks, months?

MINISTER KEOGH: So the work that we've been doing to date has been obviously getting the response together, but also looking at how we operate with the coordinating body. I've been discussing, have been discussing with the New South Wales State Government, they're supportive of that, and our agencies have been engaging with each other, not just at a Commonwealth level, but also between Commonwealth departments, and also State Government departments. And then we'll be taking that forward to work with local governments as well, so that we can identify who are the relevant people that need to sit on these coordination bodies, in terms of the departments and the individual members of the working group as well, and identifying that depending on the staff that we have.

JOURNALIST: Where are we up to in terms of remediation of contaminated land, because not sure if you're familiar with the Martin-Baker case, they’re a fighter jet ejection seat manufacturer who say if we can't have more land opening up in Williamtown, we're taking our business to the UK, USA, and all those jobs will be lost. So where are we at with that?

MINISTER KEOGH: Well, I think what that case speaks to is actually some of the opportunity that becomes available through the processes of looking at, OK, what can we look at different planning opportunities for some of that land that is close to the base, but we've got to work through that with the State Government, and the local government, as well as the industry players that are available, and of course the land owners, they own that land. But those opportunities being sought by industry provide a great example of some of the opportunities that may become available through the processes.

JOURNALIST: Are land buy backs part of the conversation as well?

MINISTER KEOGH: What the review speaks to is doing this work, is coordinated work around planning, doing the work around assessing the options in terms of mitigation, and looking at what can be done to support land owners, and the work of the independent assessor is really important in doing that. The independent assessor needs to undertake that work and provide advice to government, and particularly around what other supports can be provided to land owners where that may be required. So we're working, we'll start that work now, and we're going to work through those processes to see what options need to be undertaken to support land owners.

JOURNALIST: What would you say to people who say, "this is just more talk, we've been talking for years and years, when does the action start instead of just governments coordinating and talking to one another”?

MINISTER KEOGH: Well I think, unfortunately, what's been confronted by this community is even being a complete lack of talk by some parts of government. As we mentioned before, the community has been crying out, and their local Member of Parliament, Meryl has heard that, but the previous governments have not heard that. The calls of the community had fallen on deaf ears. And what we are doing as an Albanese Government is saying we have heard the calls of the community, we've commissioned the review that we committed to doing when we were in opposition, and now we're implementing the recommendations that have come out of that review, and recognising as well that no one can move forward if there's not a degree of coordination across all three levels of government, and also consistency across different jurisdictions, whether it's Defence land, privately owned land, what's happening here in New South Wales, what happens in Queensland, what happens in the Northern Territory. So making sure that we're doing that coordination, that there's those discussions happening between governments, and that we are keeping the community informed and that we are engaging with them on that journey. This review sets out a framework for doing that and that represents a huge step forward from where we were, but by no means is it the end of the journey.

JOURNALIST: Can you take us through that recommendation that you've noted that you said needs more investigation?

MINISTER KEOGH: So the recommendation that we've noted is about establishing working groups around Oakey and Tindal. We've got to engage with the state governments and local governments there before we can progress that. So it's really just a matter of working through those details with them which we're going to do.

JOURNALIST: In terms of next steps, is the onus on property owners to get in touch with the Government, or will the Government be reaching out to them?

MINISTER KEOGH: So the first thing we need to do is, as well as the work we're doing with the coordination body and the working group, is appointing an independent assessor and then we can talk to the property owners around how the independent assessor is going to undertake that work. But also we will be updating the information that's available on the website that we've been operating previously, which has had some updates but there's certainly particular pieces of information that the review says needs to be updated so that the community has access to that information. And of course at the ongoing round of the information sessions, like the one that's about to happen here this morning and again this evening, and then as it's required for the independent assessor, there will be direct reach out to the property owners.

JOURNALIST: From my understanding, the purpose of this review was to identify potential land use in core Defence land, but you're saying that this review has not yet identified its own land usage?

MINISTER KEOGH: What the review has done is provide us a framework for how we can move forward on identifying alternative uses for land, where property owners would like to pursue that, recognising that, to do that involves all three layers of government and multiple regulators on each of those levels. And so the reviewer has been pretty clear that they can't just identify a particular land use that involves coordination across government. That doesn't close off any land uses either and now we've got a framework in moving that forward, which is what the land owners have been calling for.

JOURNALIST: The realistic timeline, I mean what are the land owners looking at for potential for remediation or buybacks or any action in that regard?

MINISTER KEOGH: So we've got to undertake the process, we've got to do this coordination with the independent assessor, I can't put a firm date on how long that would take, because that involves working with land owners as well, but we're taking the steps that we need to do quickly around standing up these bodies and appointing an independent assessor so that works for land owners. 

JOURNALIST: I've just got some questions for Meryl. So Meryl, I've heard that there's going to be a working group established early next year. Who will be part of that working group?

SWANSON: Look, I think that's to be determined. Obviously it's going to be landholders and community members. There've been individuals that have stood out as community leaders, I'm sure that they may have an interest in being part of that. And that is something that I'll be working with the Minister and the National Coordination Body on. I'm going to be part of it, I can absolutely guarantee that. I just have to continue standing with my community. There's a lot more work to do, we know that, we've come this far. I feel today is a poignant day and I really want this to be effective.

JOURNALIST: Can you explain how the working group will report to a state or federal government body? And I'm assuming they're looking for significant issues on the ground in their community?

SWANSON: Yes, look, I'm going to let the Minister fill in the detail, but needless to say there will be a very close relationship, there has to be. This is what the reviewer, the point the reviewer made, is that this is about communication. And one of the big things that I continually think in the community is they're just absolutely hungry for more information. And also, they want to give people information about what's happening on their property, about the drainage, about what they know. I mean, there is an inordinate amount of local knowledge here about this area and how it works, and what developments might work. We know that there is a big uptick in Defence industry in this area. Now, you want to talk to lots of people, and those in government, and State Government, about how do we make those precincts viable and really successful. So it will be about communication. But I'll let the Minister fill in and then I'll come back.

MINISTER KEOGH: Thank you, Meryl. So you'll see in the review, the recommendations. The first recommendation is about establishing this National Coordination Body, working across the relevant Federal Government and State Government bodies that will also engage with the relevant local governments. The working groups that are recommended in the review see a separate working group at each of Williamtown, Oakey and Tindal. And that will involve the local community, representatives in the case of Williamtown like Meryl. But that'll be about making sure that local governments are in that engagement. And you'll see the specific recommendations that go to issues that are local to those areas. So I think recommendation 18, for example, talks about the need for the working group to work through issues around drainage, which is a particular issue here around Williamtown. They will then feed into the work of the National Coordinating Body because we do need to see a degree of national consistency around the number of planning issues, which are primarily driven by the states, but obviously involve local governments as well. Things like how is contamination reflected on land titles, for example, which is not helpful I think for any of the affected communities if that's done in a piecemeal and different way across every different jurisdiction. So making sure we have coordination of those issues that's been fed into by each of the local working groups. Thanks everyone.

JOURNALIST: Sorry, I think I have a few questions about the offshore wind announcement from Dutton this morning.

SWANSON: Oh sure.

JOURNALIST:  So we just heard from Peter Dutton that if the Coalition is elected, they are going to scrap the offshore wind farms. What do you make of that?

SWANSON: Well Peter Dutton has flown in here a number of times and he's pulled another stunt this morning to drop into our community and sprinkle his nuclear fairy dust all over Port Stephens and the Hunter. It is unconscionable for him to come here to the seat of energy on the eastern coast to be quite frank with you and say well we don't want that energy and we're going to provide nuclear off in the never never. I'm actually really pissed off, I'm just want to tell you the absolute truth. Who is Peter Dutton to come here and say we don't want energy in the Hunter, we do need energy in the Hunter. Now I have said since the conversation with offshore wind commenced, this is about getting it right. I want to look back in 15 years and say we made the right decision on that. It's got to stack up environmentally, it's got to stack up economically and it has the potential to employ thousands of people in our region. There are so many positives to the project but it must stack up. And for Peter Dutton to just come in here and say no we're not even going to consider it. We don't care about the jobs, we don't care about the energy for places like Tomago which employs thousands of people indirectly four times that. It also provides 37% of Australia's primary aluminium. It's responsible for using around 12-15% of the electricity and it actually provides a battery backup for our state. Tomago Aluminium is pivotal to this conversation. And Peter Dutton comes in and says, oh no we're not going to do offshore wind, we're not even going to look at it and say it's the right fit for our community. But we're going to build a nuclear reactor on the old Liddell site where we've had a number of earthquakes in the past few months. He hasn't answered how much it's going to cost, it hasn't even given us an adequate timeline of when we - I mean, talking about timeline on PFAS, you know this bloke’s got something 30-40 years down the track that is going to cost a gazillion more than what we might be supposed in terms of offshore wind and renewable wind. And he's got no plan to deal with nuclear waste. So you know, fair cop Mr Dutton. My advice to people is don't press the Dutton button because you do not know what you’re going to get.
JOURNALIST: I'll just make a point on this as well. A lot of people in the community aren't supportive of the offshore wind farm. There was a bit of critique this morning about there's lack of community consultation and your presence in the area. Could you respond to that?
SWANSON: Yeah, absolutely. I absolutely agree with the community that the initial consultation was poor. And I've come out publicly and said that the Department really let my community down. There was not enough information in the early days and I have made the Minister acutely aware of my displeasure over that. You know, it wasn't handled well and I think it's been a very steep learning curve for the Department and that's a good thing. They did a much better job in Illawarra and I'm pleased that that happened. But it cannot happen again. We do need good, accurate consultations and that's what the Minister has assured me. And I've seen the gateway process. We are going to have a lot of community consultation. I want people to be able to not only give their opinion on this but also get some accurate information. I think there's been a lot of dis-information spread about this. You know, coming out saying it's going to kill whales. That is just complete funkum. Whales are some of the most intelligent species on the planet. They currently navigate around the coal ships. They will be able to figure out this and it's going to be 20 to 40 kilometres offshore. You won't be able to see it from the shore, but it’s things like this that you do need to make sure are right. And the community does deserve information. What I haven't done, I haven't waded into the disinformation.  So yeah, I have not attended anti-off shore wind rallies. As I have not attended pro-off shore, I have stayed very neutral. I want this to be a scientifically properly accredited process where the community is taken on a journey, given accurate information. We're not peddling mistruths and misinformation. And at the end of the day, if they stack up, they stack up. If they don't, they don't. But we must go through the correct processes. And I want my community to benefit from this when they go ahead. If that's what the outcome is, you've got to see the best of it.
SWANSON: Thanks.
JOURNALIST: I'm sorry, one more.
SWANSON: Yep, sure. 

JOURNALIST: Just on that, with where the project is at the moment. I guess what would it cost to actually pull the project if the Government. The Government hasn’t actually given any indication of any challenges or anything like that, but in your mind, what would it take to actually have to pull it in? What would the cost be?
SWANSON: I honestly, I'm not going to stand here and make up figures. I don't know what the cost would be to do that. But I think that Peter Dutton has got absolutely no answers. He's got no answers in terms of generation of energy much quicker. He's only got answers potentially for 30, 40, 50 years down the track. And they're very expensive and risky answers.
JOURNALIST: Thanks.