Television Interview, ABC Weekend Breakfast

SUBJECT/S:Chinese Naval Vessels off the Coast of Australia.

Fauziah IbrahiM, HOST: As we've been reporting this morning, the Foreign Minister, Penny Wong has raised concerns about transparency around live firing by Chinese naval vessels in the Tasman Sea. She's raised this with her Chinese counterpart whom she spoke with on the sidelines of the G20 Summit in South Africa, in Johannesburg, in fact. Deputy Prime Minister Richard Marles joins us now from Geelong. A very good morning to you.

RICHARD MARLES, DEPUTY PRIME MINISTER: Good morning, Fauziah. 

IBRAHIM: Now, Deputy– Minister, did Minister Wong receive assurance from her counterpart that a similar incident will not be repeated?

MARLES: Look, I don't think we have a satisfactory answer from China in relation to this. To be clear, you know, my best advice is that China has acted in accordance with international law. But when Australia, for example, does a live firing event such as this, which countries are entitled to do on the high seas, and that's where this Task Group is, they're in international waters, we would typically give 12-24 hours’ notice, which enables aircraft that are going to potentially be in the vicinity to make plans to fly around. What happened yesterday was that the notice that was provided was very short. It was obviously very disconcerting for the airlines involved in trans-Tasman flights and flights that had already taken off within a situation of needing to divert their course around the Task Group, and that was obviously disconcerting. The issue that we've raised with China is the period of notice, really. And we've done that both in Canberra, in Beijing, and as you've said, Penny Wong raised this directly with Minister Wang Yi on the sidelines of the G20.

IBRAHIM: What's the normal procedure here in terms of notifying that live rounds will be used?

MARLES: Well, what would normally happen is that you would do a broadcast notification, which, to be fair, is what China did, to indicate that they were going to engage in a live firing event and that that would happen between a certain period of time. And again, China did do that yesterday. It's just that there was no notice. And also, to be clear, even having done that notification, it's the responsibility of any navy, any military, to make sure that when do undertake any live firing, you are doing so in a manner which is safe relative to any commercial traffic, be it sea or air, which is in the vicinity. To be clear, it's not certain that live firing took place, but they definitely did notify an event yesterday and they did so with very little notice, and that was the issue that was very disconcerting for the airlines involved. I think the other point to make is; it is unusual for a Task Group, a Chinese Task Group, to be where it is. It's about 640 kilometres off the coast of Australia, off Eden, basically halfway between Australia and New Zealand. It's outside of our Exclusive Economic Zone, but because it is near Australia, we have, in an unprecedented way put in place assets to shadow this, to shadow the Task Group, so that we know exactly what's happening. We're working very closely with New Zealand in relation to this. It was actually a New Zealand frigate, Te Kaha, which is in the vicinity of the Task Group now. And I've been in close contact with my New Zealand counterpart, Defence Minister Judith Collins, about this.

IBRAHIM: Now, Minister, last week the Australian and Chinese militaries were involved in a dangerous encounter. This week we have these Chinese warships providing short notice of this potentially live firing exercises. I wonder if these are actions of, I don't know, rogue officers or is Beijing trying to send some sort of a message to Australia?

MARLES: Well, firstly, there was a difference in the two. So, last week there was unsafe and unprofessional conduct, in our view, in relation to a Chinese fast jet in the presence of an Australian P-8 aircraft, and that was over the South China Sea. We were acting in accordance with international law in terms of our behaviour. And so we did very much register our concern about the activities of the Chinese fast jet in respect of that. That could have caused damage to an Australian P-8 Air Force plane. And so we were very concerned about the event which occurred last week. I think– and obviously the presence of this Task Group around Australia is not unprecedented, but it is unusual and that's why we've taken the steps that I asked the Defence Force to do, which is to have, again, an unprecedented level of both naval and air force assets to monitor what this Task Group is doing. What this speaks to, in my mind is that whilst I don't think these events are specifically connected, it points to the fact that we're living in a difficult time in, an uncertain environment and we've been saying this since the moment we came to power. We face the most complex, in some ways the most threatening strategic circumstances that we faced since the end of the Second World War. And that's actually what we are in many ways experiencing here.

IBRAHIM: On that point, do you think Beijing has been emboldened by a Trump Administration that has signalled that it does not want to shoulder the burden of global security pacts?

MARLES: I wouldn't make that conclusion. Again, in the engagements that we've had with the United States and indeed in the statements that have been made by the US since President Trump's been inaugurated, there's been a real focus on the Indo-Pacific and making sure that we see American leadership in the Indo-Pacific. And that's obviously very welcome from an Australian point of view. And when I met with Secretary Pete Hegseth a week or two ago now, he was very clear about where the focus of American leadership would be. And that, as I say, was very welcome to us in terms of our interests. So, actually, I think the United States under this administration have been very clear about their focus on this region. And so I don't make the conclusion that you just made in that question.

IBRAHIM: Ok. Are you concerned that a mishap could occur in or around or near Australian waters? And if so, and if it does happen, how will you respond?

MARLES: Well, we've long said that we're concerned about mishaps happening in the interactions of our two defence forces. And we get that our militaries are going to interact with each other, be that what we're seeing with the Chinese Task Group now, or our activities. And to be clear, you know, a lot of Australian naval activities happen in the South China Sea, much closer to China. And we're acting within our rights there, and China is acting within its rights to have this task group there. Of course, we are acting within our rights to make sure that we are shadowing it and to be really clear about what it's doing. What this means is that defence forces have to act in a manner which is safe and which is professional. In the way in which we will be, and have been shadowing this Task Group, that's the way in which we've been going about our business as a defence force. Our anxiety about the incident that occurred a week or two ago in the South China Sea with the Australian P-8 is that that was an incident which was not safe. And when that happens, there is absolutely the potential for a mishap to occur. That's why we always make that public. That's why we always make represent representations to China. It's also why I might say we have been very keen to see the defence dialogue between Australia and China reinstated. It has been at a certain level. We would like to see it reinstated to the point that it was at a few years ago. Because what that means doesn't change behaviours, it doesn't mean we don't interact, it doesn't solve the major problems, but it does enable our two defence forces to have a better understanding of our behaviours and reduce the potential for mishaps.

IBRAHIM: Deputy Prime Minister and Defence Minister Richard Marles there, thank you so much for sharing your time with us on Weekend Breakfast.

MARLES: Thanks, Fauziah.

ENDS